Review: Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike

As previously noted, there’s no denying the new Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike looks like a stealth rocket ship ready to rip over hill, dale, dirt, gravel, and mud, but how does it ride?

The Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike about to be put through the paces.

The Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike about to be put through the paces.

It’s been put through its paces – 151.6 miles to be exact – encompassing spirited lunch rides on our local ‘cross trails, longer weekend rides through local forests, even longer weekend rides in the North Carolina mountains, plus 45+ minutes deep in the pain cave at a 40+ Masters 1/2/3 ‘cross race in the North Carolina Cyclocross series. It’s definitely been ridden hard – even crashed hard on several occasions when bravado exceeded bike handling ability – and it just kept coming back for more.

In short, two descriptors kept coming to the fore over and over again as I put in the miles on  this carbon fiber steed: rock-solid and confident. More on that shortly.

The Specs

Just a quick reminder of exactly what you get out of the box. At its core, the Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike features a carbon fiber frame and full carbon fiber fork with 1-1/8″ – 1-1/2″ tapered steerer, a massive BB86 bottom bracket shell, internally routed shift and brake cables, and two sets of water bottle cage braze-ons (because you’ll get thirsty on your epic dirt/gravel adventures). There’s a no-nonsense selection of components including Shimano 105 5800 2×11-speed STI shifters, Shimano 105 5800 front and rear derailleurs, a Shimano 105 5800 11-speed 11-32T cassette, and a Shimano RS500 46/36T ‘cross crankset. The brakes are Promax Render R mechanical disc with 160mm rotors front and rear. Wheel-wise, the bike features aluminum, disc brake-specific Alex rims and aluminum Novatec hubs with 28 spokes front/rear laced 2x while the tires are Vittoria XG Pro 700×33. Both wheels utilize quick releases and the wheels are set up for running tubes with your tires. Rounding out the build are an assortment of aluminum handlebars, stem, seatpost, plus a saddle which most likely will remain in pristine condition in your home workshop as you’ll very likely opt for a swap-out to your preferred choice.

The Fit

When purchasing a complete bike it’s always somewhat of a mixed bag regarding what components you may need to swap out just to make the bike fit correctly. I’ve been dealt the physique card of having somewhat stubby legs combined with a longer torso and arms, and yet amazingly the stock, out-of-the-box set-up almost worked as is in the tested 54cm option. In order to attain my tried and true position, the only component which I substituted was the stem. The bike arrived with a 110mm length and I changed it to a 120mm option (with a -17 degree rise) to accommodate my extension needs.

The handlebars were 44cm wide – 2cm wider than my preferred width – but the extra width felt just fine and actually grew on me with each and every ride. The crankarms were 170mm in length which is actually the length I’ve ridden on both road and ‘cross bikes forever (did I mention I have stubby legs?). That was a pleasant surprise as I had expected the cranks to be 172.5mm for this frame size.

A wide, 44cm handlebar comes stock on the 54cm size Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike.

A wide, 44cm handlebar comes stock on the 54cm size Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike.

The only other substitution made was with the aforementioned saddle. I did a couple of rides on the included saddle, but to truly put the bike through its paces I opted for my go-to ‘cross bike saddle choice of a Fizik Arione. Pedals are not included so I installed a set of tried-and-true Crank Brothers Candy 3s taken from my personal ‘cross bike and for all riding except ‘cross competition I added a couple of water bottle cages to the frame for my hydration needs.

 Also of note, the head tube on the 54cm size is very much in the endurance bike realm with a length of 15.8cm – much taller than what I’m used to on my race-oriented, personal ‘cross bike – but the slightly more upright position that this bike utilizes was something soon forgotten throughout the testing. In fact, the position grew on me and makes perfect sense for what this bike is all about.

Point of reference

Riding a full carbon fiber frame/fork with disc brakes was a totally new experience for me. Call me a curmudgeon/Luddite, but my personal ‘cross bike for the past 14 years (!!!) has been a Bianchi Cross Concept with a scandium aluminum frame, a carbon fiber fork with a straight 1-1/8″ aluminum steerer, plus cantilever brakes. The components have gone through multiple iterations and currently there’s a 1×10-speed drivetrain with a bespoke mish-mash of Shimano and SRAM I guarantee is not replicated on any other bike on planet Earth. My personal bike weighs in at roughly 3 pounds lighter (18 pounds for the Bianchi vs. 21 pounds for the Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike).

The Ride

From the very first pedal stroke I was impressed with just how solid the Nashbar ‘cross bike feels. That massive BB86 bottom bracket shell helps ensure that your power most definitely goes straight to forward propulsion. And even though I was now on a bike 3 pounds heavier, I honestly didn’t feel the extra weight – even on the steepest dirt climbs in the area. The ride quality was also superb out on the trails and dirt/gravel roads. Maybe my bar had been set very low having ridden a Scandium jack hammer for so many years, but my home trails and roads seemed just that much smoother on this full carbon set-up.

The Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike in action at a North Carolina Cyclocross Series race.

The Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike in action at a North Carolina Cyclocross Series race.

While the ride quality was certainly noticed, most significantly for me was the quality of the braking with the Nashbar bike’s mechanical disc brakes. Yes, my Bianchi’s Paul Components Neo-Retro cantilevers are a bit lighter and have pretty good stopping power for what they are, but it was a pleasure to use noticeably less effort at the levers to attain powerful, lightning-quick deceleration with the mechanical disc brake set-up. And having the 1-1/8″ – 1-1/2″ tapered full carbon steerer tube, too, made a definitive difference with front braking. There was absolutely no front-end chatter on the Nashbar ‘cross bike and my confidence in attacking trails and descents at greater speed grew as I knew that a braking bail-out was a lighter touch away.

Mother Nature didn’t cooperate regarding wet, sloppy conditions – all of my riding was done sans rain – but I did have the chance to ride through somewhat marshy sectors as well as negotiate some short stream crossings. And while this may seem a no-brainer to those with disc brake experience, for me it was a novel and noted pleasure that while my tires and rims were wet and muddy, braking was not affected in the least. I will take that option every time.

Practicing some 'cross skills on the Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike.

Practicing some ‘cross skills on the Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike.

Not much more can be said of the Shimano 2×11-speed drivetrain with its 105 shifters, derailleurs, and cassette other than it all just works flawlessly from the get-go. The 46/36T chainring combination coupled with an 11-32T cassette provided a wide range of gears that are well-suited for all-day gravel road adventures. You’re covered from screaming descents through lung-busting ascents and everything in between. I found the gear ratio a bit wide for the one ‘cross race I did, but if you have one set-up for everything it still certainly will work.

 The stock Vittoria XG Pro 700×33 wire bead tires did an admirable job on the trails, dirt roads, and in competition. Their all-around tread delivered ample grip and cornering traction as well as straight-line speed.

Room for More

With the included 700×33 Vittoria XG Pro ‘cross tires, there’s still an impressive amount of tire clearance both front and rear. 700×33 is the widest tire option allowable in UCI competition (which is why you frequently see ‘cross tires with that width), and while that width option provides a pretty comfortable ride I was curious to push the limits of what the Nashbar carbon ‘cross bike could handle.

The Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike was quite at home in the North Carolina mountains.

The Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike was quite at home in the North Carolina mountains.

The final weekend of testing the bike was certainly a doozy as I enjoyed two days of riding some of the finest dirt roads you’ll find anywhere out in the mountains of North Carolina in the Blowing Rock vicinity. The stock 700×33 Vittorias were swapped out for a set of 700×38 Panaracer Comet tires. Clearance for the front tire was still good, while the rear was tighter. In fact, I don’t think you could go any wider on the rear.

Rear clearance for a 700x38 tire on the Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike.

Rear clearance for a 700×38 tire on the Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike.

Nonetheless, while some bikes these days sport tires 700×40 and wider, the 700×38 tires are still excellent options for tackling mountainous dirt roads. I’ll admit I could feel a bit more heft in the wheels when faced with dirt road climbs measured in miles, but the plushness and confidence when bombing downhill on multi-mile descents was remarkable. The 700x38s, in conjunction with disc brakes, inspired a level of descending I hadn’t thought possible and I’ll gladly take the weight penalty for what this bike can do while negotiating flatter to downhill terrain. These wider tires accentuated the bike’s stability and handling – especially at speed. In fact, I’d opt for the widest tires this bike could handle in all situations other than ‘cross racing.

Conclusion

I’m impressed. It’s really as simple as that. What you get for the money is remarkable and if you had to have one bike to do it all, the Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike would be a superb option.

 

Posted in Learn About Gear, Nashbar, Product Reviews Tagged with: , , , , , , ,

Riding Tips: Be a Better Climber

Pedaling a bicycle uphill can certainly be a source of consternation for any cyclist. There’s no getting around the pain in the legs, the burn in the lungs, the ache of the lower back, plus the test of the psyche. And while some riders are simply more gifted in conquering hills through factors such as genetics and physique, everyone has a capacity for improvement and the ability to make peace with climbing and embrace it for the challenge that it is. There’s undeniably a satisfaction unlike any other you’ll experience in cycling of going head-to-head with a challenging ascent and reaching the summit. Here are some tips to make the climbing experience that much more efficient and (dare we say) enjoyable.

Follow our climbing tips and you, too, may one day don the polka-dot jersey. Or at least be the King/Queen of the Mountains on your local ride.

Follow our climbing tips and you, too, may one day don the polka-dot jersey. Or at least be the King/Queen of the Mountains on your local ride.

Mix in saddle and out of saddle pedaling
While this is sound advice in general when riding in order to provide some relief and optimize comfort, the effects are perhaps most noticeable in the midst of a climb. Through experience and over time you’ll likely come to a preferred climbing style, but nonetheless on climbs of more than moderate length you’ll do yourself a favor by mixing up in saddle and out of the saddle efforts. As a lean, mean, climbing teenager I spent plenty of time out of the saddle, Marco Pantani style, in order to push the pace and dole out accelerations to keep competitors on edge, but as time and the physical transformation of age has made their mark I find myself these days more of a seated climber on all but the most severe pitches. Still, it feels good to get out of the saddle and mix things up if only for a mental break and something different to concentrate on. And as a tip, assuming the gradient remains the same, you’ll find it’s a good idea to shift up a cog as you transition from seating to standing as you’re able to use more of your body weight in each pedal stroke plus there’s a tendency to slightly slow the RPMs all of which having a slightly higher gear will counteract.

Become a shifting savant
As one becomes more experienced in riding uphill, you’ll pick up the ability to read the severity of a slope and be able to anticipate the correct gear to be in before getting bogged down on the slope. While the current generation of drivetrains are certainly better at shifting under load, you’ll still do your drivetrain a favor by not shifting under tremendous load. And when you do shift while climbing, it helps to back of the pressure on the pedals slightly during the actual act of changing gears to help achieve a smoother shift.

Don’t bog down
While you can certainly use raw power to muscle up a short ascent of a few hundred meters, once you begin to tackle a climb of any notable length your legs will thank you if you try to keep the gears lower and the RPMs higher. Turning your legs into lactic acid factories with plenty of climbing to go will definitely put a damper on your enthusiasm for going uphill.

It’s all in the mind
No doubt there’s a physical component to going uphill, but keeping a positive mental attitude is a remarkable asset for climbing bliss. To keep from sinking into a downer funk, break the climb into tiny morsels (think “just keep up the pace through that next turn up ahead”) and give yourself a figurative pat on the back when you’ve checked off mini-achievement after mini-achievement all the way up. Just as you don’t want to think “wow, I have 99 more miles to go” at the outset of a century ride, don’t psyche yourself out when you have multiple miles of climbing to face by focusing on the end total.

When climbing in a group, make sure to keep your front wheel protected.

When climbing in a group, make sure to keep your front wheel protected.

Mind your front wheel
Whenever you find yourself climbing with other riders, it’s imperative to monitor the distance between your front wheel and the rear wheel of the rider in front of you. When the rider ahead of you makes the transition from seating to standing, there’s a chance the bike may be thrust backwards some and possibly right into your front wheel if you’re not paying attention. Ideally, when a rider makes the transition to standing he/she will be attentive and not pitch the bike backwards much or at all, but it’s not something you can count on. Similarly, when you know there’s a rider on your rear wheel, try to minimize the degree that your bike moves backwards when moving from sitting to standing.

More distance/less effort
When negotiating switchbacks, be mindful of how steep the inner section of the road/trail can be. Yes, the quickest line through the uphill turn is along the apex, but on some climbs that section is ridiculously steep. If you’re making a left turn on a road switchback it’s easy to stay along the outer edge of the road for an easier gradient. Just be careful when the switchback is on a right turn as the easier pitch puts you out into the lane in the path of motorists approaching from behind.

Know thyself
Through experience you’ll figure out what kind of pace you can handle on climbs and how much you can push into the red without going too far. The worst thing that can happen on a climb, both physically and mentally, is to set a blistering pace early only to have yourself blow up and limp the rest of the way to the top. I fondly remember tackling a 10-mile long ascent in the Blue Ridge Mountains many years ago with a few very eager teammates and almost from the get-go my three companions danced off into the distance as the mano-a-mano slugfest got the better of them. I knew how many miles – steep miles – were ahead and just kept to my own tempo. Soon enough, teammate number 1 was dispatched about 2 miles in, I caught and passed teammate number 2 after about 7 miles of climbing, and I latched onto the wheel of my third teammate inside the final 400 meters to the top. All along my pace kept pretty steady. You just have to have faith in your ability and know when too much is too much. And even if you were in a similar scenario and didn’t catch back on with speedier companions, it’s always a good plan to start more moderately and finish strong.

A rider climbs alone in the mountains.

Solo rider vs. the mountains.

Digital motivation
In my younger days as a burgeoning competitive cyclist, I spent nearly all of my training time alone as I lived in a rural area with a dearth of fellow cyclists. Having a cycling computer made a world of difference, however, as I could use it as a motivator and task master to keep me climbing at a solid rate. “Just don’t let the speed drop below xx MPH” was a consistent mantra.

Reward
And remember, once you crest the summit, at some point – hopefully very soon – you’ll enjoy the fruits of your labor by taking in a healthy descent. And how to manage yourself on that will be the topic for another day. Stay tuned.

Posted in Cycling Tips Tagged with: , , , , , , , ,

Introducing the Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike

Introducing the new Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike

“How much more black could this be? And the answer is ‘none’. None more black.” Introducing the new Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike.

“What bike is that?” (A frequent query this week at our corporate headquarters)

In our home office chock full of avid cyclists where a myriad assortment of prized road, cyclocross, and mountain bikes are seemingly tucked away in every spare corner, it takes something special to garner notice. And the new Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike (Nashbar item # NB-CCX) certainly has that stop-you-in-your-tracks x-factor in spades.

It certainly sports a compelling stealth aesthetic with its matte black carbon frame and fork plus black components throughout. The dashes of silver in the chain, cassette, front derailleur, and brake rotors provide a nice pop of contrast to the otherwise stealth-mode styling everywhere else.

Understated Nashbar branding along the side of the top tube. Also note the internal routing of the derailleur cables.

Understated Nashbar branding along the side of the top tube. Also note the internal routing of the derailleur cables.

There’s a subtle, grey Nashbar logo on the front of the top tube that extends onto the side of the head tube as well as a small Nashbar logo on the inside of the non-drive chain stay as well as the back of the seat tube just so your friends can tell the source of this carbon fiber ‘cross wonder.

Nashbar branding (as well as contrasting grey paneling) featured on the inner portion of the left chainstay.

Nashbar branding (as well as contrasting grey paneling) featured on the inner portion of the left chainstay.

The sculpted carbon fiber frame plus full carbon monocoque fork are built to withstand all the punishment you can dish out on the trails or dirt roads.

The carbon fiber frame sports a massive BB86 bottom bracket shell.

That is one massive bottom bracket shell.

The frame features a massive BB86 bottom bracket shell to enhance both stiffness and weight savings while more slender top tube and seat stays enhance the ride quality on rougher terrain.

The carbon fiber frameset features internal routing through the fork for the front brake as well as internal routing through the frame for the rear brake.

The carbon fiber frameset features internal routing through the fork for the front brake as well as internal routing through the frame for the rear brake.

Additionally, the internal routing of the cables keeps the aesthetics as well as shifting/braking performance neat and tidy. The full carbon fiber fork, with a tapered 1-1/8″ – 1-1/2″ steerer tube, also contributes to weight savings plus helps delivers a superb ride  quality and inspires confidence no matter how challenging the terrain.

The drivetrain features Shimano 105 5800 11-speed derailleurs and cassette as well as a Shimano RS500 crankset.

The drivetrain features Shimano 105 5800 11-speed derailleurs and cassette as well as a Shimano RS500 crankset.

Shimano’s exemplary 105 components are spec’d for the 2×11-speed shifter/brake levers, front derailleur, rear derailleur, plus 11-speed cassette. The crankset, too, flies the Shimano flag as the RS500 model sports stiff, aluminum construction and 46/36T chainrings.

Promax Render R mechanical disc brakes with 160mm rotors are used front and rear. The rear hub (as well as the front) use quick release levers for retention.

Promax Render R mechanical disc brakes with 160mm rotors are used front and rear. The rear hub (as well as the front) use quick release levers for retention.

Stopping power is delivered via Promax Render R mechanical disc brakes with 160mm rotors front and rear.

The 700x33 Vittoria XG Pro tires feature a versatile tread pattern.

The 700×33 Vittoria XG Pro tires feature a versatile tread pattern.

Alex aluminum wheels are the epitome of reliability and durability with 28 spokes front and rear with stout 14g stainless steel spokes. Vittoria’s XG Pro ‘cross tires, in a 700×33 size, are true all-arounders and are plush enough to soak up rugged terrain plus deliver ample grip and traction while braking or accelerating.

Smooth lines through the seat cluster as well as subtle Nashbar logos on the back of the seat tube.

Smooth lines through the seat cluster as well as subtle Nashbar logos on the back of the seat tube.

And this post serves as just the introduction to the Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike. Tune in several weeks from now for an assessment of how this stealth ‘cross machine performs on our local stomping grounds of fire roads, doubletrack, singletrack, as well as in competition.

The author of this post in action on the Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike.

Now it’s time for a ride!

Note: The Nashbar Carbon Cyclocross Bike does not include pedals, water bottle cage, and water bottle as seen in several of these photos. 

Posted in Learn About Gear, Nashbar Tagged with: , , , , , ,

What To Pack In A Saddle Bag

What should you carry in your saddle bag?

What should you carry in your saddle bag?

Self-sufficiency out on the road/trail is of the essence. And these days carrying the tools and other handyman/woman essentials to tackle a wide variety of repairs doesn’t take up much space at all. Here are our recommendations of what to include in a judiciously stocked saddle bag (such as the pictured Nashbar Large Expandable Seat Bag).

Suggestions of what to include in a well-equipped saddle bag.

Suggestions of what to include in a well-equipped saddle bag.

(1.) Tube
A must have whenever you leave home on a ride. Nothing can ruin a ride quite like being unprepared for a flat tire. One tube is a must, but if you have the space in your saddle bag then two tubes are even better – particularly if you’re out on a lengthier outing along the road less traveled. As a bonus, having two tubes also makes it easier to play the good Samaritan role when one comes across a fellow cyclist in a spot of bother. One of my favorite rides took place while on a trip to San Francisco when I was able to venture into Marin County and the Mt. Tam vicinity. Along my stint in the Marin County I happened to come across a guy who flatted and realized (too late!) that his spare tube was flat, too, from a previous ride and hadn’t been swapped out or repaired. Having two tubes made it that much easier to save this guy’s day.

(2.) Tire levers
Having a new tube won’t do any good if you have no means to remove unseat the tire’s bead to facilitate a change. They’re lightweight, compact, and a ride necessity.

(3.) Tools
This is an area where there’s some flexibility regarding what exactly to take along. At the bare minimum, take a look at what your bike has in the way of bolts/screws and make sure you’ve got those bases covered. My most regularly ridden road bike uses 3mm/4mm/5mm/6mm/8mm Allen bolts plus Phillips screws so I make sure I possess the means to tighten any that may loosen or need adjustment. Don’t forget about Torx bolts, which are making their way into various components as well. A chain tool, too, is worth its weight in gold when it comes time to MacGyver back together a broken chain in order to pedal one’s way back home.

There’s plenty of well-crafted mini-tools/multi-tools that can meet your needs for range of tool selection, compact size, minimal weight, as well as ergonomic demands. Sometimes the combination of tool size/design combined with accessing various bolts/screws on a bike may make for a frustrating tool use experience. It might be hard to actually make adequate contact between tool and bolt/screw or apply enough force so it’s a good idea to make a dry run at reaching those harder to reach locations to ensure you can make the repair when it counts the most – away from the comfort of your own home, perhaps many, many miles away.

A master link (left) or chain pins (right) make a world of difference in the event of a chain mishap.

A master link (left) or chain pins (right) make a world of difference in the event of a chain mishap.

Master link/Chain pins
May you never have to use these, but in the event your chain gives up the ghost, these handy items will make it possible to reconstruct a broken chain and make it possible to pedal your way home.

(4.) Patches
While my modus operandi is to replace punctured tubes with fresh ones, sometimes you find yourself on one of those rides with more punctures than tubes. In that case, having a couple of patches makes a world of difference to make a roadside/trailside repair of a tube to render it rideable once again. They weigh basically nothing and take up really no space at all, so why not have a few on hand?

(5.) Cash
I prefer having some cash on hand (as opposed to a credit/debit card) because sometimes in remote gas stations/convenience stores you’ll find yourself facing a minimum transaction amount (which is typically more than I need to spend on sustenance). Plus you don’t have to worry about expiration dates and paper money serves double duty as a tire boot.

(6.) CO2 Inflator/C02 Cartridge(s)
Some form of inflation is a must, but you have options regarding the delivery mechanism. Since I’m a Luddite about many things cycling, I opt for an actual pump (frame pump on road bike, mini-pump in pocket for off-road endeavors) for tire inflation purposes. But for quick inflation in a very compact package, using a CO2 system is certainly a very popular option. Just remember to refresh your CO2 supply post-ride once the cartridges get used!

Posted in Cycling Tips, Nashbar Tagged with: , , , , , , , , , , , ,

Fast Fixes: How To Lube Your Chain

Learning how to lube your chain is one of the most important maintenance tasks that you can do for your bike. Establishing a regular chain lubrication routine does wonders for not only ensuring a quiet, efficient drivetrain but also to achieve the maximum lifespan out of your equipment.

Less is more

The primary thing to remember about chain lubrication is “less is more”. In fact, each rivet/bushing of the chain just needs one drop of lube. Lathering the chain with a gratuitous amount of lube just makes it that much easier for dirt and grime to built up on the chain – which is exactly what you don’t want. That is also why we prefer a lube in liquid form, as opposed to a spray applicator, for the ultimate in precision application.

Apply one drop of lube to each link of the chain.

Apply one drop of lube to each link of the chain.

A tip to make sure you make a complete revolution through the chain is to start the lube application process at the chain’s master link (if your chain has one) and then back pedal the chain as you lube until the master link appears again. It’s easiest to perform this task if the bike’s in a workstand, but it can also be done with the bike leaning against a wall as well. If your chain doesn’t have a master link, it takes approximately 3 full revolutions of the crank arm to run the chain completely through its course.

Wipe off excess

Once lube has been applied, use a clean rag to wipe off any excess lube on the chain and then shift through your gears to make sure the lube makes its way thoroughly into the drivetrain.

Use a rag to wipe away any extra lube.

Use a rag to wipe away any extra lube.

Whether you use a wet or dry lube, the application process is the same. The wet lube, opimized for wet/sloppy/muddy/more extreme conditions, will remain wet on the chain while a dry lube, perfect for dry/dusty conditions, utilizes an alchol base that dries and leaves a film on the chain. Ideally, you’ll let a dry-lubed chain sit a few hours before riding after application to ensure the chain is dry and fully set.

How often should you lube your chain?

That depends on your mileage as well as the conditions. When riding lower mileage in dry conditions, you may be able to go multiple weeks while harsher conditions – wet and/or muddy – warrants more regular attention.

Posted in Cycling Tips, Nashbar Tagged with: , , , , ,

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